Hello. We're Kevin Holroyd & Jake Naude and we started photoenter late last year. The number of weekly entries are picking up slowly and we can't understand why the site isn't busier??? That's why we're here and we'd appreciate it if you'd take a look at our site and give us some feedback... (or even enter a competition!)

As we do offer weekly cash prizes, here are a couple of points I'd like to make very clear before you have a look at the site and make your own minds up...

• We don't ask for your copyright, it stays yours. It's that simple!
• We don't have any hidden agenda or dodgy fine print.
• We'll never sell any of your photos.
• We don't collect email addresses - unless you sign-up for our newsletter!
• We'll never spam you or sell your email addresses on!!!
• We do have very clear and easy to find rules and terms & conditions
• We're not making money from the site yet - not enough traffic!
• We're paying the prize money out of our own pockets - ouch!
• We do want a busy site so that advertising pays for the prizes!

Contest Name: photoenter.com

Established: October 2008

Link to site: http://www.photoenter.com

Link to rules: http://www.photoenter.com/rules.aspx

Deadline: 23:59:59 GMT every week on Monday evenings

Competition 1
Prize: Editor's Choice is $140 every week
Cost: $4
Link to this comp: http://www.photoenter.com/editorschoice.aspx

Competition 2
Prize: Viewer's Vote is $50 every week
Cost: Free
Link to this comp: http://www.photoenter.com/viewerschoice.aspx

Categories/Themes: Alternates between Theme & Open each week


Please do contact us if you have any questions: http://www.photoenter.com/contactus.aspx

Thank you for your time...

Why not...?

Yep, that's the idea... What do think...?

To be perfectly honest that is the long term idea.

The free competition is voted for by viewer's who decide who the winner is.

The $4 comp is professionally judged and the judges give detailed feedback for the more discerning photographer.

We are running a business but we also want to provide a useful tool for photographers.

Just curious, how did you find Nsop?

I googled "top 10" +"photo competitions" and came across http://photocritic.org/top-50-photo-websites/ and found this site in the comments section at the bottom of the page...

Isn't the idea of this particular forum for exactly that purpose... to let people know about photo competitions that are out there and to give opinions on them to keep other members safe... I checked the rules and I'm sure I'm not breaking any...?

I just noticed that I'm speaking to member number 1...

Am I breaking any rules here...?

Should I remove this thread...?

Please advise...

I apreciate your point of view s7khan... It is a small site/community and if we were trying to pull a fast one it wouldn't take long for the negative publicity to get around. I can assure that we are an upfront website - no cons, scam etc. It happens all the time so I understand people's concerns.

Whilst I have joined the forum to advertise photoenter I'm also advising your members about a service that they might find useful and they may even win a bit of cash every now and then.

We are offering something here, not trying to con anything out of anyone...

That's not wrong is it...?

This is your site and I'll understand if you pull the plug on this thread...!

I'm simply making people aware of our site.

It's there for people to use or not use as they see fit.

Personally, I think we're struggling exactly because of the point that you've made about the money. People probably think that's the only reason why we're in it and don't stop to look at the real benefits we offer...

I don't get it...

I guess you are right... Sorry but I'm fairly new to forums and don't know all the etiquette...

Wise words that I'm busy learning the hard way... Cheers...

Thanks for letting it stay and for your honest feedback...

It is a tough nut to crack and you are right, I need to get in front of my local camera clubs and talk to them and sell the concept face to face...

Thanks for the advice... Cheers...

Thanks... That's me done for the day - wish I could have a pint...! Cheers everyone...!

Originally Posted by bleuquila

I'll actually give some feedback, cause why not! It's not like I have work to do

Woah I got sort of angry typing this up! The load times were fueling my ire.

Hi Bleuquila,

Thanks for taking the time to give such detailed feedback. Much of it was negative but it was honest and also based on fact which is what feedback is all about... Feedback isn't about skirting around issues with flowery words so I do appreciate yours.

You had a lot to say so I'll respond to each of your points...

1) the site is slow, I got fed up in like 5 seconds trying to load photos. Even the FAQ are so slow I stopped caring by the time one answer had popped up. Popped up in a separate frame, btw. see below.

Resonse: What speed internet connection do you have? The FAQ and Links pages are slow but I didn't think they were that bad...

2) arg frames. Double arg having your forum in a frame.. don't do that, it's annoying. Don't have the FAQ in a frame. There is seriously no reason to do that, just have it all in text, with # bookmarks if you want.

Resonse: The loading speed of the forum in a frame is a huge problem... It takes longer than all the other pages to load... Yes, the FAQ and the LINKS will work better without frames... Agreed...

2.a) Make the forum better - more polished, more prominent. This should absolutely be a link on the left, not hidden down in the bottom, if you don't nurture a community or provide a lot of resources/tools/info that are valued a photography website is doomed to fail. Since you don't really provide the latter, I suggest you work on the former. If there isn't content or conversation people won't really come back.

Resonse: I agree...!!!

3) my god it's slow

Resonse: Can't be that bad, surely...?

4)There's a paragraph of text under editors choice/ viewers choice on their respective pages that weirdly flickers in an out depending on what I mouse over. Annoying.

Resonse: I thought that was quite a clever little addition to keep the site clear of text clutter... No...?

5) this is subjective but I don't care for the site appearance. The cartoony bubbles of color it's all very 2002, and I don't like it. It doesn't look professional to me, and almost certainly not worth a fee.

Resonse: I like the look, but you are right, "beauty is in the eye of the beholder"

6) Judges: who are they? one of them had a totally blank profile/blurb. looks shady and unprofessional. "Meet the Pro's" "the Judges decision is final." <- fix those.

Resonse: Who are they... Google them... They've been in the industry for ages and ages and are great photographers...

7) uhg I just timed how long it took to load "Last week's Gallery" 50 seconds. And you want me to pay you for the honor of submitting to a gallery so atrocious its practically guaranteed no one will go and look at it?

Resonse: Another subjective opinion perhaps...

8) the "feedback" that is ostensibly worth the entry fee: All if it amounts to nothing more than lovely photo I really enjoyed it! see: "A child's joy will always be something special and an image to share and this is a great example. Sheer joy and exhilaration. The muted autumnal complimentary colours add to the very atmospheric image. Brilliant composition, spot on timing, lovely lighting and you just have to smile at the lads expression. A gem."
^ that's .... meaningless. Even a comparatively small community like this one I can find worlds better feedback on both photo merit and technical advice. For free.

Resonse: I have to agree that we could improve the structure and the amount of detail they supply here. I'm open to suggestions but perhaps it could look something like this...

• A general comment
• What I liked
• What I didn't like
• What I would do differently
• A score out of 100

oi.. that's all I can take.

If you take one thing away from this, it should be the the very thing that is supposed to be the focus of your site, user-submitted photos, is infuriatingly hard to access and sure to repel most people.

Resonse: I agree with this point. It has been suggested that we put 2 buttons on the home page that would take you directly to the current week's photos...

positives: the free submittal section has more worthwhile shots in it than the paid contest, unsurprisingly. but still overall quality isn't that good. Someone who actually took the time to wade through all the nonsense might actually be able to pick up a cash prize! For me, the effort just isn't worth it, and that's kinda what it comes down to. I didn't even make it to the voting process, but from skimming the faqs that showed up I'm willing to bet it's far too involved/annoying.

Resonse: Was that positive?

Thanks again for taking the time to reply Bleuquila... Yours is exactly the type of response that I'd hope for when I submitted this post.

This is a very lively forum... Excellent... Cheers

/end rant

Originally Posted by QJ

^ what he said

Although it didn't take 50 seconds for pages to load on my end. Some loaded in 15 and others in 30 seconds. Still longer than I care to wait by far.

Also, if you are taking advice - dump the $4 entry fee. That's just plain silly. I'm surprised anybody at all has paid it so far. Go for targeted advertisers to foot the bill now before the site implodes. And speed that sucker up!

Good luck and I may stop by again sometime to see how it's going and possibly enter to win!!! (the free one of course)

Hi QJ,

Agreed... 15 to 30 seconds is far too long... You make a valid point about the $4 fee and imploding... Point taken onboard... Cheers...

Originally Posted by By Chance

all enter, im thinkin of it as he just showed us a contest that gives us a chance at 50 dollars, yeah not much but its free. If you dont like the 4 dollar cost to join the contest with more prize money i dont see what the problem is just dont join it. Its not a spam or virus site so i dont see the problem. But i hope ounce u get higher traffic and make money off traffic that you take off that 4 dollar fee for the higher end contest etc.

Thanks for the positive comment! It would be a pleasure to see you win... Good luck...

Originally Posted by s7khan

Stupid website crashed my computer at work.

It shouldn't crash your computer as such but there have been a few occasions where an Internet Explorer window has frozen when running IE6 or an older version... The site was optimised for IE7 or up...

Originally Posted by MK19

It crashed mine as well...

Sorry...

Originally Posted by MK19

Easy there new guy...

Thanks for the support new guy...

Originally Posted by Tylersladen

give him a break,
his website is safe
and that 50$ for free would be nice

Thanks for the support... Cheers...

Originally Posted by bleuquila

as far as giving dude a break, hey he came here and asked for feedback as to why people might not care to submit photos there. Mine happens to have a negative bent to it, but what can ya do, I think there are real reasons as to why traffic is slow. He asked, the least I can do is explain why. (well, that's a lie. The least I could do would be to just ignore it).



I'll see how stuff loads at home most sites here are fine but every now and then one happens along that the work computer just hates.

Hey it's me again... As a said earlier... All feedback (within limits) is really appreciated... Cheers

Originally Posted by photoenter

Hi QJ,

Agreed... 15 to 30 seconds is far too long... You make a valid point about the $4 fee and imploding... Point taken onboard... Cheers...

It actually wasn't long at all from my laptop.

And the whole $4 fee thing come from personal experience. After we launched our magazine several years ago we tested the readers willingness to "subscribe" for a yearly charge of $9.95 then dropped it to $4.95 when nobody subscribed. They could still read the content for free but the subscription would allow them to be part of the community, have a profile page, upload photos to their own galleries, use the chat box, forum, and a few other things. We weren't looking to get rich from the subscribers just help pay for the cost of running the magazine, i.e. - hosting fees, beer money for our time spent editing and publishing...

When we saw after a month or so that people didn't want to pay even a minimal charge for what they could get for free elsewhere we dropped it like a bad habit. Our readership continued to grow and we average anywhere from 40,000-60,000 unique visitors a month. We are not huge by any means and thankfully it doesn't cost much to keep the site up. Big plans to grow the mag have been shelved for now but we will continue on the road we are now because it's fun.

So when I say dump the $4 entry fee that's where I'm coming from. There are many places photographers can enter their photos to win stuff for free so why would they pay you? That is the question you need to ask yourself and see if you have a good answer that holds merit. If not, then you know you should dump the fee.

Originally Posted by QJ

It actually wasn't long at all from my laptop.

And the whole $4 fee thing come from personal experience. After we launched our magazine several years ago we tested the readers willingness to "subscribe" for a yearly charge of $9.95 then dropped it to $4.95 when nobody subscribed. They could still read the content for free but the subscription would allow them to be part of the community, have a profile page, upload photos to their own galleries, use the chat box, forum, and a few other things. We weren't looking to get rich from the subscribers just help pay for the cost of running the magazine, i.e. - hosting fees, beer money for our time spent editing and publishing...

When we saw after a month or so that people didn't want to pay even a minimal charge for what they could get for free elsewhere we dropped it like a bad habit. Our readership continued to grow and we average anywhere from 40,000-60,000 unique visitors a month. We are not huge by any means and thankfully it doesn't cost much to keep the site up. Big plans to grow the mag have been shelved for now but we will continue on the road we are now because it's fun.

So when I say dump the $4 entry fee that's where I'm coming from. There are many places photographers can enter their photos to win stuff for free so why would they pay you? That is the question you need to ask yourself and see if you have a good answer that holds merit. If not, then you know you should dump the fee.

Hi QJ,

Thanks for qualifing what you meant by dropping the $4 entry fee. Really appreciate your comments and they make perfect sense too. Your initial comment about the site imploding hit home hard.

Based on feedback we received here and some of our own UAT we're going to be making a few changes to the site over the next few weeks...

Here are the 5 main changes...

• We're dropping the $4 Editor's Choice competition completely and are looking at inroducing a second Viewer's Vote comp - also free entry with a $50 prize. One comp will have a theme every week and the other will be open every week. 2 free comps, 2 $50 prizes, 1 open, 1 themed... Both voting based... No judging...

• The Personal Profile page will get a scrollable list of "screen names" to make it easy to browse straight to a member's profile...

• The forum button is increasing in size and moving up from obscurity into the Left Navigation Pane...

• We're losing the frames from the FAQ, Links and Forum pages to speed them up a little...

• The banners at the bottom of the page are moving down further to below the bottom row of navigation buttons to get them out the way a bit more...

I'll let you know as and when we impliment the changes...

Thanks again for your input and for everyone else's here at NSoP...

Cheers...