Release in March-April. It will have 39.5 Megapixel, SDHC card, DNG format, HDMI.

*********

1. how much
2. how big is the sensor
3. SD?

HDMI!

wait-what's-the-point?

**** you pentax!

i ain't switching back!

Apparently this is their breakout into the digital medium format business.

39.5MP... lolwut?

Haven't they had a prototype body at shows for a couple years now? Will be interesting to see the price on this baby (and how many new lenses they develop for it).

Originally Posted by uwmechengr

Haven't they had a prototype body at shows for a couple years now? Will be interesting to see the price on this baby (and how many new lenses they develop for it).

exactly, if it's FF they won't need new glass really, but it'll be a REALLY expensive sensor. If it's not FF they'll need new glass which will be $$$. I'd LOVE to have a 645 "full frame" digital sensor for landscaping though, provided it had a nice wide to go with it.

More info...

http://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/p...il-2010-a.html

Rumored street prices at around $8,000

http://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/p...nual-leak.html

Normal 645 (at least following Pentax specs) is 56 × 41.5 mm (from 120 film - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) or 69.7mm diagonal.

This 39MP Kodak sensor would be 36.7*49mm and 61.2mm diagonal. Indeed a 1.1X crop (based on diagonal calculation).

In terms of area:

1798,3mm² for the Kodak sensor
2324mm² for the original 645 format.
On area based calculation: 1.3X crop (if didn't make any mistake).

For comparison:
FF is 864mm²
APS-C is about 375mm² (thought there are a couple differences following sensors)
4/3 is 243mm².

no storm trooper edition? auto-fail.

There have been rumors of this thing floating around over on PF for a while. Also the rumor it will be a Japan release only...Who knows. I can see where the 645 lenses would go up in price because of this, since they would all work on that "crop" as they were all for a full 645 image circle. Most of the 645 AF lenses are already ridiculously expensive. I have looked into adapting a 645 Tele for that purpose, but too damn expensive, and not worth the justification. I could go with old FA* 35mm primes and still probably save $$ or break even. This could be a "thrifty" alternative to the people spending ridiculous money on Mamiya/Leaf systems, or Hassie's, even with the crop. I will be interested to see the IQ, and reviews once it hits, and then what they do to develop the technology into a full frame 35mm body. Hoya says they want to make Pentax profitable in 2010, but if they're gonna do it, they need to go the full frame route, and annouce it early to mid 2010, and then follow through with it. I think the K7 and the K-x has sold well, but not enough to rescue them. Also, the need to make a more robust lens lineup, to include a UWA star lens for crops, and a better long tele-zoom/tele-prime lineup (100-400* lens, and a lens above 300 prime) and once the full frame body ever happens, they need to give full framers a robust lens line-up. So they have a lot of work to do, and the 645 is not the body that is going to save their brand. Make it accessible to everyone. I think this thing (645) is kind of a red hering. I wish they would have focused elsewhere.

-Andy

I disagree. Canon/Nikon have the FF market pretty well locked up. Yes Sony has one as well (using the sensor they make for Nikon) but even that doesn't sell that well. So a fourth FF option w/o a great lens base would be a very expensive (in terms of R&D for the lenses) project for them. Jumping the medium format works well for pentax because the lenses are already there and people won't be so insistent on their AF performance because of the nature of MF... So if they bring this bad boy out at a significantly lower price point -vs- the leafs and other options out there, it could be AMAZING for them.

edit:
yeah, $8k might be a tad too much -vs- a 1Ds/D3x... $3k buys you two wicked lenses to go with those bodies and a smaller/lighter system... Do you really need 40mp? Some people will, and this is a LOT cheaper than normal backs, so that's great. 1.3 is a nice size, the pixel pitch on this thing should be TINY right? More than double the space with "only" 40mp puts it at <20mp if it were a FF 35mm sensor? I wonder how the IQ will be? Imagine 40mp with amazing IQ at more than just base ISOs (where MF is amazing now)...

Hrm, after a few price drops, a 40mp 645 body could be very tempting.

Originally Posted by jacobsen1

I disagree. Canon/Nikon have the FF market pretty well locked up. Yes Sony has one as well (using the sensor they make for Nikon) but even that doesn't sell that well. So a fourth FF option w/o a great lens base would be a very expensive (in terms of R&D for the lenses) project for them. Jumping the medium format works well for pentax because the lenses are already there and people won't be so insistent on their AF performance because of the nature of MF... So if they bring this bad boy out at a significantly lower price point -vs- the leafs and other options out there, it could be AMAZING for them.

edit:
yeah, $8k might be a tad too much -vs- a 1Ds/D3x... $3k buys you two wicked lenses to go with those bodies and a smaller/lighter system... Do you really need 40mp? Some people will, and this is a LOT cheaper than normal backs, so that's great. 1.3 is a nice size, the pixel pitch on this thing should be TINY right? More than double the space with "only" 40mp puts it at <20mp if it were a FF 35mm sensor? I wonder how the IQ will be? Imagine 40mp with amazing IQ at more than just base ISOs (where MF is amazing now)...

Hrm, after a few price drops, a 40mp 645 body could be very tempting.

Yeah but you still have to pay for the damn glass, which is proprietary, and expensive. Older MF 645 glass isn't to bad, but if you want FA lenses, stand by.

-Andy

And I will agree that they do have the full frame market locked up. But I think if Hoya didn't have this requirement to make them profitable in a year, then I think Pentax could really R&D a new body, bring the hype, bring it to market, and hit a home run. Doesn't even need to be a 20+ MP sensor. Just do their homework, and give some time. Hoya might need to stimluate the company for a bit to make it happen. It kinda depends on how Hoya wants to make the company profitable. Pentax has been a niche/cult company for a long time, and trying to make them compete against giants right away could be bad. Maybe if they just put out a well thought product, that stands up to the hype they give during the pre-release marketing, they could start to sway some people away, or get people just starting out. For example I think the Sony 850 is a great way for someone to break into FF without going broke.

-Andy

^ yeah, I could see them doing either something like the a850, something like the 5D "classic" for even less, or doing the "3D" body most of us canon guys wanted (D700).

basically, DON'T get involved in an expensive MP "war". Use lower MP counts and up FPS and add some memory to move **** around, but go for super clean files and budget above other specs. A even more modern ~12mp FF camera right now could be done for not a ton of money and I'd bet sell well if the IQ is there.

Originally Posted by jacobsen1

^ yeah, I could see them doing either something like the a850, something like the 5D "classic" for even less, or doing the "3D" body most of us canon guys wanted (D700).

basically, DON'T get involved in an expensive MP "war". Use lower MP counts and up FPS and add some memory to move **** around, but go for super clean files and budget above other specs. A even more modern ~12mp FF camera right now could be done for not a ton of money and I'd bet sell well if the IQ is there.

Exactly, I would love something in a D700/5D type body. Gimme the weathersealing they already do, and up the FPS, and do like Nikon did, make it hand-grip expandable, also, gimme CF or a combo of CF with SD. And make it less than 3K-2.5K and they could have a great body. I don't care if it has 4 times ludicrous MP count. I am on 14.7 right now, and I think that is plenty. I think maybe a 15 sensor would be great for them to start with, or 12 if need be. I just think the 645 is a niche camera for a niche/cult company, which from a marketing and profit standpoint is not what they need right now. The K7 is leaps ahead of anything they have done before, but still not the answer to keep people like me from leaving the ship someday .

-Andy

Plus the fact that legacy glass for Pentax is all over the market, you can buy into the body, and still not go broke. I think they could make this part of their marketing point also. Not to take away from the glass that they would have to make to go full frame, but maybe even offer some of the old glass that I know is still kicking around the Pentax Factory in Japan, and put it on the market. You can still buy old Pentax glass from the factory in Japan. (F and FA stuff.) Or even offer a factory refurb program where they sell refurbed lenses (granted they would have to go and aquire stuff), at a reduced cost to generate sales?? Probably wouldn't be cost effective though. But maybe like the Canon Loyalty program sort of?

Sorry to thread-jack LUCA.

I've been wanting a histogram exposure mode for YEARS (basically, where the camera won't clip either end if possible, +/-EV moves the meat of the histogram one way or another). And EVF makes this easier to accomplish because it forces the camera to use/look at the "live" image...

my comment on the EVF is because I've wished for this years ago, and back then old school retards (PotN) told me it couldn't be done as the camera didn't have access to the histogram until it wrote the file. This was right around the time liveview was coming out. So yeah, however they want to make it work, having an EVF makes it BLATANTLY OBVIOUS it's possible, that's what I was trying to say.

Live View is an implementation of an EVF.

Edit: the more I think about it, the more I like the fact that modern DSLRs offer both an optical viewfinder (which consumes little to no power) and an EVF in the form of LiveView (it's there when you want it, and gone when you don't).

Originally Posted by Markitos

I wouldn't get your hopes up--they've rumored this camera every year for like the last five years. I remember talking to a friend of mine about the specs being leaked about this time last year.

Great idea, and I'd bet Pentax HAS had something in the works, but who knows if it'll ever see the light of day.

Stop being a negative Nancy, Mark.

Originally Posted by Kilonad

Live View is an implementation of an EVF.

I know?

Edit: the more I think about it, the more I like the fact that modern DSLRs offer both an optical viewfinder (which consumes little to no power) and an EVF in the form of LiveView (it's there when you want it, and gone when you don't).

agreed, now if they could figure out some way to make the optical take less space w/o making the view smaller/darker, then I'd be really happy. Nanocrystalopticspentawhatnow?

Originally Posted by Markitos

I wouldn't get your hopes up--they've rumored this camera every year for like the last five years. I remember talking to a friend of mine about the specs being leaked about this time last year.

Great idea, and I'd bet Pentax HAS had something in the works, but who knows if it'll ever see the light of day.

Originally Posted by Donkeypunch

Sorry to thread-jack LUCA.

No worries, I still love you Andy.

Originally Posted by Markitos

Hey, don't look at me--you should be bitching at Pentax!

That ship sailed almost a year ago!

Originally Posted by Kilonad

Hate to burst your bubble, but this one isn't going to happen. The size of the prism is dictated by the size of the sensor.

pssssssssshaw!!! Never say never!!!

Originally Posted by Markitos

Hey, don't look at me--you should be bitching at Pentax!

I do constantly

-Andy

The countdown has officially begun, this should be interesting...

http://k-rumors.com/k5-countdown-for...-645d-started/

A few sources have said the body will go for $6,500

I am excited. Seriously.

Hmm, so would this be the first camera to natively support DNG?


-A

when's that counting down to anyway?

and I agree with Shawn, I'm seriously excited. I'd love an inexpensive MF option for landscaping and arch... This -vs- a D900 could eventually be that option (just dreaming).

These pics were released from Pentax Japan on the 16th...

Originally Posted by Angelo

Hmm, so would this be the first camera to natively support DNG?


-A

my k20d had the option of .pef or .dng.

Originally Posted by Markitos

Color me interested! Just what I need--another big, expensive camera body!

+1

although it's funny, KEH's catalog came last night. There was a leaf back in it for ~$4k. I'd LOVE to have a digital setup similar to the film setup I had in college:

• film P&S -> GF1
• 35mm for speed/sports/travel -> D700
• bronica 645 for quality/landscapes/paid shoots -> MF digital or 20+mp DSLR

yeah, for me and arch/landscaping it works, but it's still a PITA in terms of size/weight/speed. The other issue for me is lenses, arch NEEDS width, MF doesn't have a lot of lenses wider than 20mm and their sensors aren't even "full frame" yet as far as I know. So for those reasons the high MP DSLR bodies make more sense, they're just not as.... romantic?

But especially when you consider just BUYING lenses, if I have them for the second option and they can work for the third, why go with an entirely different system for the third? Hell, I could even go with a canon body (if that made sense) with an adapter and nikon lenses if needed (something I've considered with the 5Dii).

I just really wish I was shooting arch enough, and selling landscapes at all so I had these problems IRL.

Originally Posted by jacobsen1

[*]bronica 645 for quality/landscapes/paid shoots -> MF digital or 20+mp DSLR

Don't you have a focus-dead Canon 5dmk2? Landscapes and architecture would work on it, right?

Oh, and that Leaf back in the KEH catalog caught my eye as well. I'm going to upgrade my stuff by the end of the year. That got me thinking.

Originally Posted by jacobsen1

arch NEEDS width, MF doesn't have a lot of lenses wider than 20mm and their sensors aren't even "full frame" yet as far as I know.

Are you meaning 20mm "equivalent"? Because MF goes pretty darn wide, in terms of AOV a 28mm on 6x4.5 MF is like 17mm equivalent on 35mm FF, which is ~11mm on APS-C. The fact that tilt/shift is an accessory mount for a lot of MF bodies is another huge plus for architecture.

Originally Posted by Andy

Don't you have a focus-dead Canon 5dmk2? Landscapes and architecture would work on it, right?

Originally Posted by jacobsen1

Hell, I could even go with a canon body (if that made sense) with an adapter and nikon lenses if needed (something I've considered with the 5Dii).

Originally Posted by Porter

Are you meaning 20mm "equivalent"? Because MF goes pretty darn wide, in terms of AOV a 28mm on 6x4.5 MF is like 17mm equivalent on 35mm FF, which is ~11mm on APS-C. The fact that tilt/shift is an accessory mount for a lot of MF bodies is another huge plus for architecture.

yeah, I mean equivalent. Their wides are like 40s~60s depending on the MF format we're talking. That's BEFORE you factor in the sensor not being "full frame"... Shifting would be rad for arch for two reasons. The obvious keystone fixes, but also because a shifting lens can make a format wider than it is... So shifting a MF lens to stitch images could work, but I'd have to look into what adapters work with what bodies and lens combos and math out effective FLs once stitched. The short answer is you're never going to get to the width of a 14~16mm lens on a DSLR with ~20+mp using medium format, at least not easily. Canon's 17mm TS-E is also the king in terms of wide arch lenses really as it's 17mm natively, but it stitches to ~13mm and ~40mp with a 5Dii....

Originally Posted by jacobsen1

This thread has many words. Me not read all of them. Hurt head, it does.

closeup of the memory slots.

^ cool!